MLK Jr. & Fred Hampton
Bart Black (aka “HackMKUltra”) and Nathan Coe (aka “ShiftShapers”) answer questions from the GNN community
Part I, in which Bart & Nathan debate directly, can be found here.
Number5Toad: You’ve said in the past that things like cars and businesses are “inherently violent” because of the destruction to ecosystems and loss of natural life that are required to create them. By these standards, isn’t all of organic life then inherently violent?
Nathan: This is, if anything, a baited and loaded question, but it itself begs another very important question: at what point do human creations cross the line from “natural” and “organic” to “unnatural” and “inorganic”? This, as I see it, is a matter of semantic interpretation and definition regarding these dichotomous terms. It is certainly possible to pursue a line of logic that leads to the conclusion that nothing that humanity could do or create is “unnatural.” Again, this is a matter of semantics, but I would argue that the real issue is systemic environmental destruction and exploitation, not to mention the human costs, not whether or not we chose to label it as “unnatural” or not. Words are, after all, simply auditory symbols used to communicate ideas. They are mutable and subjective. The real issue is that the system we have created exceeds the carrying capacity of the planet, and is thus fundamentally and terminally unsustainable. Animals exceed the carrying capacity of their land base “naturally” all the time, but it is still not a state of existence you want to be in, particularly if you are a self-aware and self-reflective being who is also aware of your environment and the potential future consequences of your actions in the present. The result of any living being exceeding the carrying capacity of its land base is always a crash and return to sustainable levels of population. All biotic beings are subject to the limited parameters of the natural world, including human beings.